Number: 904

Date:  1-May-84 18':05':15

Submitter: Sannella.PA

Source: Jeffrey Shulman <SHULMAN@RUTGERS.ARPA>

Subject: Document XNS packets that 1108 sends out

Lisp Version: 

Description: '
Received': from RUTGERS.ARPA by PARC-MAXC.ARPA;  5 APR 84 18':16':56 PST'
Date': 5 Apr 84 21':16':44 EST'
From': Jeffrey Shulman <SHULMAN@RUTGERS.ARPA>'
Subject': Need to know a few XNS things'
To': LispSupport.pa'
cc': SHULMAN@RUTGERS.ARPA, marantz@RUTGERS.ARPA'
'
'
	Roy Marantz has gotten up a preliminary 3Mb to 10MB packet'
"transmorgifyer" so our DLions can talk to our DEC-20 3Mb Pup based'
software (this all runs on an 11/60 running as a gateway between the'
two.)  There are only a few problems':'
'
	1) What XNS does the "Install Lisp Tool" send out before it will'
	   do a PupFtp "install"?  What should we say back to start the'
	   Pup based transfer?'
'
	2) Every second or so the DLion sends out an XNS packet for I believe'
	   routing info.  What should we send back to shut it up?'
'
	3) During a "1 boot" when it asks for the time (code 937 on the'
	   display panel) it does this with an XNS packet.  What is'
	   the format of an XNS date/time request?'
'
	Item 1 is critical to our continuing use of DLions since we'
generate our own images to use daily.  Thanks.'
'
							Jeff'
-------'
'
Date':  6 Apr 84 17':01':58 PST (Friday)'
From': JFung.pasa'
Subject': Re': Questions from Shulman'
In-reply-to': Sannella.PA''s message of 6 Apr 84 12':19':43 PST (Friday)'
To': Sannella.PA'
cc': JFung, LispSupport.pa'
'
Mike,'
'
I hate to "speculate" on item 1, I can collect XNS packets with the CourierPeekTool (SDD''s tool).   If you can wait, I''ll try to gather these packets for you.  But, I will be in El Segundo testing DEI-DLion file transfer (teknowledge''s crisis), next monday, tuesday....'
'
Here is the speculation if you can''t wait.'
'
1).	What XNS does the "Install Lisp Tool" send out before it will'
	do a PupFtp "install"?  What should we say back to start the'
	Pup based transfer?'
	'
	The Install Lisp Tool does not send XNS packets on PupFtp install. When Dlion is power-up, the pilot boot file sends some XNS packets, like CH''s BroaadcastForServers (pkt-exchange), CH''s Retrieve Item(courier), Time-request/response(pkt-exchange), Router-request(Routing Info) packets.'
	'
When you retrieve sysout from NS file server, you will then encounter some XNS packets like':'
	a.	Open-Connection {SPP system packets, sst=0} Pkt'
	b.	Series of Filing (Courier) packets (Logon, Open-Directory, Open-Drawer, Open-Folder, Store, followed by proper Closes)'
		I am not certain whether BulkData Transfer protocol is used in Pilot 10.'
	c.	I am not sure whether Close-Connection packets (SPP with sst 254, 255) are used.	'
		'
Is this what they want?	(Im not sure whether I answered to the point)'
'
'
'
3).	The XNS Time-Request packet is documented in XSIS Misc. Standards.  This may still be Xerox private.  Here is the format':'
'
Time-Request Packet Format':'
'
	Level-1':'
		word 0':		Checksum'
		word 1':		packet length'
		word 2':		transport control/packet type'
		word 3-7':	destination address (net/host)'
		word 8':		destination socket'
		word 9-13':	Source address	'
		word 14':	source socket (time-socket =8)		'
'
	Level-2':'
		word 0-1':	packet-exchange ID'
		word 2':		client type (1=Time packet)'
		'
    '
	Level-3':'
		word 0':		Protocol version'
		word 1':		Request type (1)'
		'
'
'
Time-Response Packet Format':'
'
	Level-1':'
		word 0':		Checksum'
		word 1':		packet length'
		word 2':		transport control/packet type'
		word 3-7':	destination address (net/host)'
		word 8':		destination socket'
		word 9-13':	Source address	'
		word 14':	source socket (time-socket =8)		'
'
	Level-2':'
		word 0-1':	packet-exchange ID'
		word 2':		client type (1=Time packet)'
		'
    '
	Level-3':'
		word 0':		Protocol version'
		word 1':		Response type (2)'
		word 2-3':	Current Time (GMT)'
		word 4':		Offset direction'
		word 5':		Offset hours'
		word 6':		Offset minutes'
		word 7':		Start of DST'
		word 8':		End of DST'
		word 9':		Tolerance flag'
		word 10-11':	Tolerance (+/- msec).'
	'
-----'
'
Date': 11 Apr 84 15':05 PST'
From': vanMelle.pa'
Subject': Re': Questions from Shulman'
In-reply-to': Sannella.PA''s message of 10 Apr 84 17':13':15 PST (Tuesday)'
To': Sannella.PA'
cc': vanMelle.pa, Masinter.PA, Sheil.PA'
'
Aside from containing potentially private data, his answer is not even correct.'
'
(1) is the problem that Mesa is sending out the XNS packet requesting the Dandelion''s Pup identity.'
'
(2) I''m inclined to believe this is related to 1 or 3.'
'
(3) His answer is only half correct.  The protocol he describes is indeed the official XNS time server protocol (which might be private, but is easy to infer); however, Mesa boot uses a nonstandard variant of it.'
'
Chuck Hedrick at Rutgers has asked some of the same questions.  And I long ago sent Hedrick the protocol for (1).  Recommend Shulman and Hedrick get together.  There ought to be a single site liaison over there!'
'
	Bill'
'
-----'
'
Date': 25 Apr 84 11':26 PST'
From': vanMelle.pa'
Subject': Re': Need to know a few XNS things'
To': Shulman@Rutgers'
cc': LispSupport.pa, vanMelle.pa'
'
	1) What XNS does the "Install Lisp Tool" send out before it will'
	   do a PupFtp "install"?  What should we say back to start the'
	   Pup based transfer?'
'
This is the request for pup identity.  I long ago sent the specs to Chuck Hedrick.  Recommend you coordinate with him.'
'
	2) Every second or so the DLion sends out an XNS packet for I believe'
	   routing info.  What should we send back to shut it up?'
'
Could you clarify?  Is this when running Lisp or the install tool?  Is it really continuous?  Any hint as to what the packet contains?  It''s conceivable it''s a request for NS routing info (a packet whose format is documented in the publicly available NS transport protocols document), but Lisp sends these only every 3 seconds and times out after 15 seconds or so if nobody responds.'
'
	3) During a "1 boot" when it asks for the time (code 937 on the'
	   display panel) it does this with an XNS packet.  What is'
	   the format of an XNS date/time request?'
'
It''s a "packet exchange" packet.'
'
In the NS header':'
Type = 4, Socket = 8'
'
In the NS body':'
Word 0,1':	ID (chosen by requestor, copied by responder)'
Word 2':	Client type = 1'
Word 3':	Version = 1'
Word 4':	Operation = {Request(1), Reply(2)}'
In the response only (values essentially same as in Pup time ops)':'
Word 5,6':	Date&Time (GMT)'
Word 7':	Offset sign = {west of Greenwich(0), east(1)}'
Word 8':	Hours offset from GMT'
Word 9':	Minutes offset (usually zero)'
Word 10':	Start of DST'
Word 11':	End of DST'
Word 12,13':	Clock tolerance (msecs; ignored by Lisp)'
'
There is an unofficial variant of this protocol which is similar, but is type = 123 and omits words 2 and 3 of the body.   I think this protocol is used by at least some versions of the install tool.'


Workaround: 

Test Case: 

Edit-By: 

Edit-Date:  1-May-84 18':01':08

Attn: Release

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Disposition: 

System: Documentation

Subsystem: Internal System Documentation

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File Server: 

Server Software Version: 

Difficulty: Hard

Frequency: Everytime

Impact: Annoying

Priority: Unlikely

Status: Fixed

Problem Type: Documentation

Source Files: